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Darendor
Location: Red Deer, Alberta, Canada, Earth, Sol System, Milky Way Galaxy Gender: Male Total Likes: 89 likes
| | | Re: Let's Talk Ethics < Reply # 40 on 6/1/2016 7:46 PM > | Reply with Quote
| | | Posted by sirpsychosexyWhere are the ethics of the owners that let historically valuable items rot away? | So, if I park my car for 3 weeks on the street, and you wander by each day noticing it's not moving, would you decide to yourself, 'Where are the ethics of the owner of this fine automobile, to let it just sit here rotting away?' My point is that possession is 9/10ths of the law. The owners have a legal right - because they own it - to let it sit there forever, if they so desire.
| Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. - Leonardo da Vinci |
| sirpsychosexy
Location: Netherlands Gender: Male Total Likes: 396 likes
| | | | Re: Let's Talk Ethics < Reply # 41 on 6/1/2016 9:39 PM > | Reply with Quote
| | | Posted by siper This isn't stealing. You were essentially hired to salvage these items to create a museum display.
| No I think you got me wrong. We dug up these bunkers for years illegally, and took the things we found without permission, because we saw the historical value in them and no one else did. Then the local government realised that WW2 history is kind of a 'hot topic' nowadays so when we asked, they let us dig up a nice bunker and furnish it with our finds. They could've said "hey you stole this stuff from us!" but they know very well that saying that would be bullshit, because we rescued very rare items from rusting and rotting away and now it's on display for everyone to enjoy. I probably expressed myself wrong, ethics are needed (I'm not tagging locations don't worry) but ethics too strict are bad. I'm talking about the 'I never touch anything in a location and you shouldn't either!' people. I think we should judge a situation with common sense in stead of living by some black and white white rules. We all hate it when people tag ugly shit in our beloved buildings, but on the other hand there are great artist (look up: Pete-One) who paint beautiful works of art in abandoned buildings. I'm glad to see that many people on this forum share this vision though. Posted by Darendor would you decide to yourself, 'Where are the ethics of the owner of this fine automobile, to let it just sit here rotting away?' | I have no interest in cars, but if I had, and I saw a beautiful car neglected and rusting away in a collapsing shed, of course I would. But you're giving an extreme example, when I see your car parked for three weeks I don't think "hey this car is probably abandoned by it's owner so I'll take it". When I see a car in a shed that has been abandoned for 70 years and the owner either doesn't live anymore or clearly doesn't give a shit about it, it's a different story. A few years ago an oldtimer treasure was found under a castle. It was a hot location in urbex world. Until a few weeks later when the cars were removed and sold in an auction to enthusiasts who restore and cherish these cars. I don't know the legalities of it but I'd say bless them for rescuing valuable things, even though the urbex location was gone.
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| Steed
Location: Edmonton/Seoul Gender: Male Total Likes: 2666 likes
Your Friendly Neighbourhood Race Traitor
| | | | Re: Let's Talk Ethics < Reply # 42 on 6/2/2016 2:30 AM > | Reply with Quote
| | | Posted by Darendor It's a "damn Coke bottle" to you, but to an avid Coca-Cola memorabilia collector, it's prize gold. I actually know someone who is into collecting all things Coca-Cola, hence my example.
I think we could all - or at least mostly - agree that there is no hard and fast code of ethics here. Sure, most of us more or less claim to explore for the sake of exploring and taking pictures... no stealing, no vandalizing, etc. But each person is different, and each person assigns different personal values to different objects (and scenarios, for that matter). The Coke bottle in the above example. Sure, lots of people might go "pfft whatever". But let's turn that on its head for a second. Suppose that Coke bottle was instead a 10 kilogram bar of solid gold. Suddenly, your values are in the spotlight. Do you take it? If you don't, someone else might. That gold bar could be worth tens of thousands of dollars after all.
It's different for each explore(r), I would say.
| Sure, we can expect to have as many different opinions as there are members on this site, and most of us probably get along and explore with people whose rules clash with our own. And I admit, Coke and Pepsi both taste way better out of a glass bottle.
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| xraychick
Location: WNC Gender: Female Total Likes: 49 likes
| | | Re: Let's Talk Ethics < Reply # 44 on 6/2/2016 10:30 AM > | Reply with Quote
| | | Everyone has good points. I read one, and think ya that makes sense. then read another and, oh that makes sense. If its being demolished, someone still owns it. Ethically I feel it would be wrong to steal something from a site. On the other hand, its probably obvious the person doesn't care to salvage historical documents and items. If they did, you'd figure they would have had them removed already. Maybe? If you feel that strongly that its your duty to save them, I am no one to say differently. But maybe think, who else will enjoy what you've taken? Will the items sit in a box in your garage? Perhaps, if we see sites being demolished, if we want to be truly ethical in all manner, ask the owner if they are trying to preserve the place. If they say no, ask if you can take some things. Or ask if they would donate items to local historians. I'm not telling anyone what to do by any means. Just trying to offer up an all inclusive ethical alternative. I don't want to be a party pooper. T
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| NotBatman
Location: MSP Gender: Male Total Likes: 443 likes
Secret Cult Member
| | | Re: Let's Talk Ethics < Reply # 45 on 6/2/2016 12:59 PM > | Reply with Quote
| | | I used to legit not take anything from above ground (except that one time I found a legit walk-in vault full of forty year-old porn) but then I fell in with a bad crowd. Nowadays I'll collect a few bits and bobs, mostly only wall signage. Stuff that has no value, but that makes me smile when I put it on the wall in my office at home. I've taken a few keys and knick-knacks from here and there, if they're interesting enough. Gun Cabinet keys, the head of a golf club from a factory that used to make them, or employee ids left onsite somewhere, that kind of thing. If I found gold bouillon, you're goddamn right I'd take it. Underground all bets are off. I will plunder the ever-loving shit out of drain treasure - mostly old coins, keys, or rings.
| I'm a "Leave only footprints, take only pornography" kind of guy, myself. |
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