Yah, I'm gonna have to go ahead and side with the bleeding hearts. Stupid reason to die or not, the lives of innocent people were changed forever because of what happened and that's why I think it's disrespectful to say that shit.

It could be argued that falling 250 feet in a grain silo and dying is also a "stupid way" to die, seeing how it's trespassing and you shouldn't have been there anyway. Will you all mock and laugh at my death if that happens to me? I certainly wouldn't if it happened to any of you.

Posted by Stewie Yah, I'm gonna have to go ahead and side with the bleeding hearts. Stupid reason to die or not, the lives of innocent people were changed forever because of what happened and that's why I think it's disrespectful to say that shit. It could be argued that falling 250 feet in a grain silo and dying is also a "stupid way" to die, seeing how it's trespassing and you shouldn't have been there anyway. Will you all mock and laugh at my death if that happens to me? I certainly wouldn't if it happened to any of you.

I'm not mocking or laughing at anybody, nor would I mock or laugh at you.
But I would say that you died as a consequence of your actions - that what you did/were doing was your choice and your choice alone and ultimately led up to your death, however tragic it would have been.

That's all I'm saying. Car related deaths are gruesome and nobody deserves to experience or witness that stuff.

If anyone else cares to jump on the bandwagon of judging a 15 year old girl who was murdered by a 24 year old man,send it to me by PM,this is beyond pathethic now,I have nothing left to say here.

And if we're airing PM's,here's my PM response I sent to Lexi,for those who may not have seen it.

to Lexi - Re: re: hamilton killing - Mon Apr 14 2008, 4:09 PM



I agree that their situation (and again,there's much more behind that story)got way out of hand and shouldn't have happened at all. When the case is tried in court,one will learn more about what exactly instigated the incident.

Having once lived in that rotten neighbourhood myself as a young teenager,I have a little more insight as to how life is down there,which is a far cry from suburban neighbourhoods on the mountain. In places like that,you learn to either protect yourself and 'stand up',or be beaten down at every opportunity by kids that live miserable lives,with very little to hope for.

It's not my place to tell Maegan's story,but her and her brother got a rotten deal in life,and I know that Maegan was a victim of bullying and had more than her share of beatings and such in her short lifetime. She was moved around from one place like that to another and I'm guessing she eventually became a product of an environment that's hard for anyone to adapt to. This same girl also knew more than one of the other teenage murder victims in the past year,which makes it even harder for her to ably judge what people may or may not do.

I don't think that you,me or anyone else have any business to say that 'life goes on',when they're wallowing in grief. Yes,people get over it,but making light of a crummy situation isn't called for.

I understand what you're trying to relay,but I'm sure you know that the world is full of 'if only' and 'what if's,and I simply won't ever judge a child of her circumstance and youth for such things.

***************

I'm out,have at it,folks.

I'm sorry if you didn't want the PM posted, but it was what I wanted/was trying to say already pre-written for me.

Posted by Stewie Yah, I'm gonna have to go ahead and side with the bleeding hearts. Stupid reason to die or not, the lives of innocent people were changed forever because of what happened and that's why I think it's disrespectful to say that shit. It could be argued that falling 250 feet in a grain silo and dying is also a "stupid way" to die, seeing how it's trespassing and you shouldn't have been there anyway. Will you all mock and laugh at my death if that happens to me? I certainly wouldn't if it happened to any of you.

Indeed I would Matt.

The fact of the matter here is that this girl, who may have been a victim of bullying herself was being a bully on this occasion. Apparently she bit off far more than she could chew here, and ended up dead. She had no right to be where she was, and no right to confront the person she was confronting.

This is a tragic situation, and even though it is unfortunate, it happens every day. It could, just as easily, have been a knife or a gun that killed her. If people sit back and say that this was stupid, and take some time to tell their kids how stupid this whole thing is, instead of crying, somebody might learn something.

Wiccan put it best.. "In places like that,you learn to either protect yourself and 'stand up',or be beaten down"

Don't the people being mobbed in an attempt to be run out of the neighbourhood have the same right to "stand up" and defend themselves or be "beaten down"

They defended themselves, and somebody died.

End of story.

Posted by KONG This is a tragic situation, and even though it is unfortunate, it happens every day. It could, just as easily, have been a knife or a gun that killed her.

It makes me wonder how much the method of her murder is the cause of this uproar. Would people be as up in arms about this if she had just been another shooting victim? Or is the fact that this was a more gruesome death than usual cause so much emotion?

No, it's because she's 15 and she hasn't had a chance to become a single mother yet.

Or has she?

It's Hamilton, don't be too quick to doubt.

Shame on almost all of you. She was only 15, true that her actions caused her death... but she was only 15. Not old enough to grasp the scope of the situation. When they attempted to run the other woman out of the neighbourhood, they were wrong, but they were just stupid, immature, teenagers. The other woman and the killer could have easily involved the police to resolve the issue, every person involved was wrong. The killer is the worst of them all, he is old enough to know better, I hope he spends a long time in prision.

She did not deserve to die, she is the victim. Period.

Very sorry that this thread was hijacked....

RIP to both the young lives lost, both stories are so sad and the deaths so unneccessary.

Posted by Nvr2loud Shame on almost all of you. She was only 15, true that her actions caused her death... but she was only 15. Not old enough to grasp the scope of the situation. When they attempted to run the other woman out of the neighbourhood, they were wrong, but they were just stupid, immature, teenagers. The other woman and the killer could have easily involved the police to resolve the issue, every person involved was wrong. The killer is the worst of them all, he is old enough to know better, I hope he spends a long time in prision. She did not deserve to die, she is the victim. Period.

I'm sorry, but she antagonized the situation which very clearly makes her more than just a victim. In fact, she's the catalyst that caused the entire situation to begin with.

15 is not an innocent age devoid of all knowledge of responsibility or the consequences of their actions. Especially with the type of environment she was from, she knew damn well what could have happened.

Posted by Nvr2loud Shame on almost all of you. She was only 15, true that her actions caused her death... but she was only 15. Not old enough to grasp the scope of the situation. When they attempted to run the other woman out of the neighbourhood, they were wrong, but they were just stupid, immature, teenagers. The other woman and the killer could have easily involved the police to resolve the issue, every person involved was wrong. The killer is the worst of them all, he is old enough to know better, I hope he spends a long time in prision. She did not deserve to die, she is the victim. Period. Very sorry that this thread was hijacked.... RIP to both the young lives lost, both stories are so sad and the deaths so unneccessary.

15 year olds can grasp much more these days than you seem to give them credit. Every week I work with a group of inner city kids after their schoolday ends for a few hours, and I'm frankly amazed at some of the things they talk about. The majority of these kids are in their 3rd form or approximately 9 years old, and I've seen them roll fake joints and smoke them... to talk about beating their 'bitches' to put them in their place ... to write me a note describing how much of a "fucking dyke" Hilary Clinton is.

So, I don't believe you for a second when you say 15 year olds are too naïve to grasp this sort of situation.

What do you expect will happen when you approach a woman with EIGHT of your friends and threaten her? Think she'll invite you in for some tea and crumpets?

I really hope that's not what kids thing these days.

Posted by Brind I'm sorry, but she antagonized the situation which very clearly makes her more than just a victim. In fact, she's the catalyst that caused the entire situation to begin with. 15 is not an innocent age devoid of all knowledge of responsibility or the consequences of their actions. Especially with the type of environment she was from, she knew damn well what could have happened.

I agree with you, all I'm saying is that she is too young to understand realistically that her actions could have resulted in her death. People her age are prone to believing they know everything and that they are invincible. Not an innocent age devoid of all knowledge however an age where there isn't enough life experience to understand the seriousness of the situation. It was clearly a game to the teenagers, we are big and tough and 'you' will leave our neighbourhood. She still did not deserve to die, and due to the fact that her death is the only death.... she is the victim (even if her actions caused the outcome)

Posted by stealthy So, I don't believe you for a second when you say 15 year olds are too naïve to grasp this sort of situation. What do you expect will happen when you approach a woman with EIGHT of your friends and threaten her? Think she'll invite you in for some tea and crumpets?

Not too naive to grasp the situation... too young, self-rightous, and immature to understand that when you attempt to drive someone from their home, they could respond with violence beyond your expectations.

What do I expect will happen when I approach a woman with eight of my friends and threaten her, I expect she will call the police or find nine of her friends to attack us. If she dosen't have nine friends, maybe a gun, or a knife, or a CAR will work to ward us off.

What did this girl expect, I can only guess.... her and friends expected to actually make that woman leave her home. They probably expected very little fight from the woman. They were probably too stupid to realize that had the police been called, they would have been in trouble. They likely figured that if the police arrived and they explained the previous incident, the cops would even help the woman leave. They did not believe that some guy would run them down with a car, or they wouldn't have been around the roadway.

She is still a victim. I am just sad that such a young life is gone over such a trivial matter.

Well,now that emck00's thread has been completely taken over (my sincere apologies to her),I thought I'd thank Nvr2loud and a couple of others who had the tact of not calling a deceased 15 year kid,known to me,a 'bitch',"she had it coming'or what have you.

Though clearly it doesn't matter,I'll point out that the woman in question did not live at the residence,nor did Maegan initiate the prior or final incident.Yes,she participated,which she paid for with her life,but I don't think that the mob mentality that erupted occurs only with teenagers.I don't know about anyone else,but I've seen plenty of the same type of shit happen with adults. The adult in this situation decided to drive his car into the crowd of kids after the incident was over,instead of calling the police so if anyone is a dumb fuck (who TOTALLY knows better) I'd say it was him,no?


Some people are getting all emo and shit over the Lister Block lately and although I have no personal attachment to that building,I have the maturity to understand that some truly do care about it. Shall we debate on whether an eighty something year old derelict building that still has a lot of potential deserves to be demolished? Should I include a veiled jab about a backhoe flattening it dead to the ground?

Ah,fuck it.I just hope that good old irony doesn't bite anyone in the ass here,as very often tends to happen. Don't worry,I wouldn't make fun of you.

Well put Wiccan.

This isn't a debate worth bothering with, it'll just cause anger on top of already surmounting stress over the incident. The Lister Block issue is definitely ironic.

Thank you Stewie,and yes,how very true.

Posted by Brind Why do people think you need to be more respectful of someone just because they died? If they didn't deserve it in life, they don't deserve it in death. All PC bullshit needs to eat a cock.

Muthafukken werd, yo.