Hey guys...

Need your thoughts on this... the wife's Caravan was nearly empty on power steering fluid, so I went and grabbed some ATF+4 and topped it off. Everything seems to work normally now, though I think there's a little air working through the lines still because it kinda burped a little after I tested it. I'm watching it, but again seems to work normally.

So here's my issue - there was only a tiny puddle, maybe 10 drops worth, on the floor of the garage, and only maybe 1 more drop on the driveway. The drops were slightly more centered under the car, a bit forward and just to the passenger side of center. This is slightly offset from the P/S pump, which itself is located high and rear on the passenger side of the engine.

The drop/puddle location doesn't make too much sense unless it's leaking at/near the pump and then running down the block or the mount before falling. And again, it was maybe 2 teaspoons in the garage and 1 drop on the driveway. No other noticeable leaks recently.

I got under the car and can't seem to find anything weird, including no apparent fluid run trails. The pump is still in good shape too. After the Stratus, I definitely know the difference between a bad pump and just low on fluid. Once I got more fluid in, it was plenty fine. Even low on fluid, it steered easily, but groaned and shuddered a little. No squeals or whines like a dead pump.

Only other notable details to share is that this seemed to happen rather suddenly when we got back from Christmas shopping yesterday. I pulled into the driveway and hit the pothole at the end where the apron meets the street, and it kinda made loud crinkly noise like a big heavy paper bag, and then groaned a little when I straightened the wheel. I turned the wheel a few times before pulling into the garage and it seemed fine, so I parked it. This morning brought the groaning.

So I'm just watching it for now, but wanted any further advice you guys might be able to provide. Thanks!

Could the rack be leaking?

Posted by jeepdave Could the rack be leaking?

I'm wondering that myself... the driver's-side rack between the tie rod and casing seemed like it had a little ATF on it, but that's the wrong side from where the drips fell.

Now it's also shuddering a little on hard right turns (90 degree from stop, or turning into the driveway kind of thing). Still easy enough to steer, just makes a bit of a juddering noise.

Well, it's the rack. Pulled the boot off the driver's side and it was kinda full... still not enough fluid to blame for the near-empty reservoir, but it's clearly a bad seal on the driver's side of the rack.

Bandi - does the Routan still use the same overall rack assembly, despite the revised suspension? If so, what's the estimated repair time you've got in the manual? Just trying to get a ballpark hours before I start calling shops.

Thanks!

VZ

Posted by velcrozeppelin Well, it's the rack. Pulled the boot off the driver's side and it was kinda full... still not enough fluid to blame for the near-empty reservoir, but it's clearly a bad seal on the driver's side of the rack. Bandi - does the Routan still use the same overall rack assembly, despite the revised suspension? If so, what's the estimated repair time you've got in the manual? Just trying to get a ballpark hours before I start calling shops. Thanks! VZ

Windstars were notorious for this shit... Didn't know Caravan's did it too.

Looks like the part (new OEM replacement, not rebuilt) goes for 250-325, so I'm hoping only 2 hours of their time...

Its been a while since I have worked on the current generation Caravans, but I think there's a cooler for the power steering...if I were you, I would check those connections.

Posted by Agent Skelly Its been a while since I have worked on the current generation Caravans, but I think there's a cooler for the power steering...if I were you, I would check those connections.

05 is the last MY before current gen... it's still a jellybean, not a box.

Posted by velcrozeppelin Bandi - does the Routan still use the same overall rack assembly, despite the revised suspension? If so, what's the estimated repair time you've got in the manual? Just trying to get a ballpark hours before I start calling shops.

Not entirely sure... I think the newer generation is totally different mechanically, but I'll look into it tomorrow.

Posted by bandi Not entirely sure... I think the newer generation is totally different mechanically, but I'll look into it tomorrow.

Thanks, sir! I couldn't find any mention online and don't have a Chiltons. I just don't want to get ripped off since places around here can charge like $120/hr now.

whoops. double post. also, dont mean offense to mechanics, just haven't found a super trustworthy shop in roch yet. lots of seedy places. we've got tons of monro mufflers/pep boys/meinekes/etc. and a few other local shops that I've tried, and almost every time the shop has told me that because of something the previous shop did wrong, that I would need more work. There's one shop I REALLY like, but it's near my old job, which is now wayyyyyy to far away to go to as a primary mechanic (like 30 miles each way kinda thing...) so yeah, i definitely don't mean to lump mechanics all together, because i know guys like Bandi are super honest.

Alldata gives 4hrs for rack replacement, plus a wheel align on top of that.

Posted by Clutchy Alldata gives 4hrs for rack replacement, plus a wheel align on top of that.

Amazing! Thank you! I did not know about AllData... this is going to be my new best friend.

Posted by velcrozeppelin whoops. double post. also, dont mean offense to mechanics, just haven't found a super trustworthy shop in roch yet. lots of seedy places. we've got tons of monro mufflers/pep boys/meinekes/etc. and a few other local shops that I've tried, and almost every time the shop has told me that because of something the previous shop did wrong, that I would need more work. There's one shop I REALLY like, but it's near my old job, which is now wayyyyyy to far away to go to as a primary mechanic (like 30 miles each way kinda thing...) so yeah, i definitely don't mean to lump mechanics all together, because i know guys like Bandi are super honest.

my Beretta came from Rochester... definitely some seedy shops there judging by some of the work done on it.

Posted by velcrozeppelin 05 is the last MY before current gen... it's still a jellybean, not a box.

Ohhh...then YOU DO have a power steering cooler and actually there was a TSB about some power steering issues. I'll see if I can find it.

Regardless, check the PS cooler connections...I bet you will find the source.

Skelly - I don't think it's the cooler. That TSB was taken care of when we bought it. Plus, the cooler sits just barely on the passenger side of the steering shaft, acting as a secondary reservoir or sorts, and any leaks that were showing up yesterday were either too far to the passenger side, or on the rack on the driver's side.

However, I took the van to work this morning instead of the Vic, and the problems seem to have disappeared. No shuddering, even when cornering under load. And there wasn't any fluid on the garage floor... like not even a drop.

What a fucking mystery... the only thing I can think of is that my father-in-law borrowed the van in October and brought it to a Chevy dealership for oil change/fluid topoff/tire rotation/etc. before the trip, and I'm wondering of the Chevy dealership put in something other than MOPAR/Mopar Certified ATF+4 and it thinned out too much and slipped the seals. I've seen multiple TSBs and forum posts saying that using anything but ATF+4 can do really bizarre things for the vans...

I'll keep you posted... Thanks to all of you for the help so far!

Posted by velcrozeppelin What a fucking mystery... the only thing I can think of is that my father-in-law borrowed the van in October and brought it to a Chevy dealership for oil change/fluid topoff/tire rotation/etc. before the trip, and I'm wondering of the Chevy dealership put in something other than MOPAR/Mopar Certified ATF+4 and it thinned out too much and slipped the seals. I've seen multiple TSBs and forum posts saying that using anything but ATF+4 can do really bizarre things for the vans... I'll keep you posted... Thanks to all of you for the help so far!

They probably put in regular PS fluid.

So the Routan and your gen Caravan are totally different- called a friend at a shop about what kind of job it is in yours, but haven't heard back yet (he's rather busy!)

Wikipedia suggests that the Routan went back to my gen's steering and suspension components but then revised them to have a more VW-like ride. Interesting.

Thanks for checking, Bandi! I appreciate it. This is looking like a $150 rebuilt part plus 4 hours, though...

Just for giggles, I called down to a contact I have over at the Chrysler dealer in town in the Parts department and he tells me first its interesting trying to look up Routan parts on his side, but he was able to tell me the Routan steering is showing up for him at least as a "non-Mopar part" nor giving him any part number he can look up on WorldPac. Its even showing up as "return and rebuild" when you look at RockAuto.

The Caravan he knows on the current generation Caravans comes from TRW and he's thinking perhaps its a Bosch steering assembly based upon the diagram he can pull up which he located me on some VW parts website: