Coming from a Christian this may sound bizarre but I am really getting tired of the Evangelical Christians in the United States. Their latest debacle has me shaking my head and wondering where the saying "Love the Sinner Hate the Sin" ever went. There is a video directed to elementary school kids that teaches children tolerance through various clips of mainstream cartoon characters singing along to the 70's music hit "We Are Family." From what I saw there are no references to sexuality so what is the big deal? Do you think the Evangelical Christian groups have gone too far, are they sacrificing some of the teachings of Christ for political clout?

The Article and Video Clip
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6852828/

Yes they are. I have yet to meet a diehard evangelical who follows the teaching, "love the sinner, hate the sin." Sadly, they spread hate of those they feel are sinful. Evangelicals, such as this wackaloon, represent a greater threat, in my opinion, than any terrorist, for these Reverends of the Ridiculous are a threat to free speech, thought, and frankly, sanity.

"Besides, if you want an example of homosexuality on kids TV, look no further than Bert and Ernie."

Colonel Stacy of Chicken Canon Fame, The Royal Canadian Air Farce, CBC Television, 2001

Posted by apprentice Yes they are. I have yet to meet a diehard evangelical who follows the teaching, "love the sinner, hate the sin." Sadly, they spread hate of those they feel are sinful. Evangelicals, such as this wackaloon, represent a greater threat, in my opinion, than any terrorist, for these Reverends of the Ridiculous are a threat to free speech, thought, and frankly, sanity. "Besides, if you want an example of homosexuality on kids TV, look no further than Bert and Ernie." Colonel Stacy of Chicken Canon Fame, The Royal Canadian Air Farce, CBC Television, 2001

The above quote was a poke at Pat Robertson's comment from 2001 that Tinky Winky of the Teletubbies was a character who promoted gay lifestyles because he is purple and carries a bag (that could be a purse). Kind of funny since the sex of each teletubby is never specified.

This issue has been a real thorn in my side lately. I nearly walked out of the movie "Shark Tales" with my kids last week due to the films thinly disguised gay agenda but, like Looney Tunes, sometimes only an adult can understand the real message in the cartoon and they would have been heartbroken if I made them leave. If it had been any more overt, I definitely would have yanked them out of there. We are called to love the sinner, hate the sin, but that doesn't mean we are supposed to accept the sin as ok.

No, you don't have to accept the sin but neither you nor anyone else has the right to defame, malign, or treat as second class citizens anyone whom doesn't see your point of view.

BTW, what specifically in the movie had a gay agenda? I haven't seen it but I'll have to check this out.

Posted by apprentice No, you don't have to accept the sin but neither you nor anyone else has the right to defame, malign, or treat as second class citizens anyone whom doesn't see your point of view.

You are absolutely correct and I take issue with anyone claiming to be a Christian who would do such a thing. We are called to love each person regardless of what they do, even the most vile and hideous things. This is the most important commandment and also the most difficult to keep.

I wish I could remember in detail exactly what was said in Shark Tales that made my skin crawl but the most offending part was during a scene when the shark is laying on a couch much like in a psychiatrists office. Without promoting the film more, I would like to know if anyone who sees the movie has gotten the same impression

Posted by Curious_George Coming from a Christian this may sound bizarre but I am really getting tired of the Evangelical Christians in the United States. Their latest debacle has me shaking my head and wondering where the saying "Love the Sinner Hate the Sin" ever went. There is a video directed to elementary school kids that teaches children tolerance through various clips of mainstream cartoon characters singing along to the 70's music hit "We Are Family." From what I saw there are no references to sexuality so what is the big deal? Do you think the Evangelical Christian groups have gone too far, are they sacrificing some of the teachings of Christ for political clout? The Article and Video Clip http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6852828/

Actually, no. It doesn't.

In every religion, there are some people that adherents wish had less air time. Dobson is one of these for Christians.

The radical Evangelical Christian movement (Of which Falwell and Dobson are prime examples) have blatantly ignored the teachings of Christ in search for personal power. These are often the same groups pushing for institutionalized prayer in schools and foisting their brand of religion on school goers. To this they have concocted a "conspiracy" by nebulous evil types to make a wholly secular nation.

We won't even talk about their take on the 1954 and 1956 Acts which had no secular purpose. (1954 - Added "under God" to the pledge of Allegiance. 1956 - changed national motto to "In God We Trust", commanded its printing on public money, and changed the oathes of office for federal judges to include "so help me God".)

Posted by Trixi This issue has been a real thorn in my side lately. I nearly walked out of the movie "Shark Tales" with my kids last week due to the films thinly disguised gay agenda but, like Looney Tunes, sometimes only an adult can understand the real message in the cartoon and they would have been heartbroken if I made them leave. If it had been any more overt, I definitely would have yanked them out of there. We are called to love the sinner, hate the sin, but that doesn't mean we are supposed to accept the sin as ok.

Why did the gay agenda make you want to leave? I'm just trying to understand another perspective. I haven't seen the movie so that probably doesn't help. But I mean, do you see being gay as a sin and so anything promoting homosexuality offends you enough to make you want to leave? And is it an intellectual sort of thing or is it more like watching someone vomit and you are revolted?

what would you propose people do? Add a gayness warning along with the parental advisory?

Not everyone is tolerant in this world. I want to see this movie because I want to see wtf the fuss is. But I digress, the gay community has an agenda and is out to get us. Oh no....they just made me gay.

There is no gay agenda. All that gays and lesbians want is to live in peace and be accepted as part of our society. African Americans went through such discrimination in the 60s (and still do to a large extent) and now it is considered (and justly so) wrong to discriminate against them. It was the southern right wing Christians who fought to keep segregation. Now it's southern right wing Christians like Falwell, Roberts (the Oral dude) and Robertson who speak and spread hate against gays. Trixi needs to do a google search and see what research is showing about what makes people gay. Nurture maybe but genetics seems to be the most prevalent theory.

I have an old friend who realized he was gay when he was 15. He DID NOT choose to be this way. He fought to be hetero but he could not. He tried to commit suicide 3 times because he could not bear to be gay due to the discrimination he would face from his classmates and our church. Not to mention the possibility his family would disown him. He could not make himself feel an attraction for a female. It wouldn't happen. He has been seriously beaten and called a fag for years. Do you really think he chose to be this way??

I guess some of you will say that he didn't pray hard enough to Jesus to be straight. I say get your holier than thou head out of your ass. This is why I refuse to subscribe to the views of any religion; they claim to preach love but wish hellfire and damnation upon those they feel aren't righteous enough. Sorry Christians but I will love my fellow man or woman because it is the right thing to do, not because some fantasy sky god told me to in a book.

END RANT

Posted by apprentice I guess some of you will say that he didn't pray hard enough to Jesus to be straight. I say get your holier than thou head out of your ass. This is why I refuse to subscribe to the views of any religion; they claim to preach love but wish hellfire and damnation upon those they feel aren't righteous enough. Sorry Christians but I will love my fellow man or woman because it is the right thing to do, not because some fantasy sky god told me to in a book.

AMEN!

As I haven't seen the movie, I will refrain from making any judgements on it. I can only say that if I was at a movie with my children, and I was uncomfortable with the subject matter, unless it was along the lines of sex or language, I would keep them in there. And then we would talk about the subject, explain what I think about it, and what others might think about it, as much as I could in an age appropriate manner. I want them to know all sides though, as I want them to be able to make their own decisions about how they feel.
Children will be exposed to these things, there is no way around it, and it is up to the parents to explain it to the children. I would rather they learn certain things when I am able to explain it, so that they get in the habit of coming to me when they don't understand something.
But that's just me.

As a parent it is my responsibility to shield my children from anything I feel is damaging to their psyche. I really could care less what anyone does in private, as long as its kept private. And whether it is a sin or not is not for me to judge.

All I object to is that I personally do not believe it is morally correct, and since I am very devout in my beliefs, I feel the obligation to extend them to my children. I have never taught them to disrespect another human of any race, disability, sexuality or whatever. They are taught to respect all life and share the love of God with anyone they come into contact with. If I don't want them to be taught that homosexuality is normal, OK behavior then that is my right. Regardless of whether it is the fault of the person or if its genetic or some other thing or combination of things, I do not believe we are made to be this way. That is my belief, and just as everyone else is entitled to theirs, so am I.

It's apparent that this is a very touchy subject. I will back off the topic because I really don't have anything further to comment on. Thanks for the response.

With that line f thinking, you might as well teach your children to avoid lepers, cancer patients, the physically or mentally disabled.

Want to see the video?

Check out this link.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6210240/

Part way down the page, there is a link to Olbermann's show where he played the entire video.

Dobson's claims are so unfounded as to be laughable.

I thought it might be interesting to find out what Mr. Dobson had to say in his own words. Here is a link I found to him "setting the record straight":

http://www.family....tters/a0035339.cfm

Indeed. I read the whole thing.

When he talked about parts of the website that had "mysteriously" disappeared once this whole thing began, it made me think. Aren't there sites that hold archives of what websites used to look like? If so, it would be pretty easy to prove!

Nooo you guys took my carefully worded question and started ranting and giving strong opinions before trixie could reply! I really want to understand how exactly it works when people have the strong opinion that being gay is wrong - I want to know if it is an intellectual thing where they reason that it's not right (it certainly doesn't make any sense evolutionarily speaking, etc.) or if it's more of a feeling they get.

An intellectual thing. The Bible says clearly that homosexuality is wrong, therefore; those who follow the Bible believe that homosexuality is wrong. We may or may not feel repulsed when looking at a gay couple, but the important part is the intellectual belief that it is wrong.

I consider myself a Christian but I don't belive that homosexuality is wrong. If I believed everything that was in the Bible I'd have to also belive that it was wrong to eat shrimp and women on their period need to be locked up in a little shack. When I was younger I actually did feel that homosexuality was wrong because the Bible said so, but I finally just thought it over myself... sure it may not be what nature intended but it doesn't hurt anyone, and if someone is born like that why would God punish them for their inherent feelings?