Posted by MrGreenJeans Simple. Christians are not under the mosaic jewish covenant prohibiting haircuts and pork.

It's in the bible - where is the part about picking and choosing which parts to follow? Which parts god was right about, and which part god was wrong about? Why didn't he just say what he means?

Are YOU allowed to eat crow? You should like the taste by now...

Posted by MrGreenJeans The bible does condemn gayness among women.

Show us where is says this please.

Posted by MrGreenJeans If very few Christians actually follow the teaching of Jesus does that still make them really Christians?

The teachings of christ are immoral, confusing, archaic so contradictory as to be impossible to follow to the letter. What does that make x-tianity?

Posted by MrGreenJeans As far as gayness goes, you said it yourself - some gays make the choice not to act on their perverse desires. Are you still an arsonist if you never light a fire? Whether or not you engage in a homosexual lifestyle is very much a choice.

Why do you care where people want to put their cocks? Why is it perverse to you? Are you scared of catching the gayness? You can argue all day about what it means to be gay, but at the end of the day you are a scared little boy grasping at misinterpretations of bronze age story books to justify your hate.

There is no good reason to condemn homosexuality.

It's such a small curb to hop over to get on with your life, maybe it's time to take off the training wheels and make your own decisions about what is right and wrong based on reason.

i still laugh when people say that we 'choose' to be this way. Hardy har har... yeah, like it's something where you wake up and say, 'jeez, i think i'll be gay now.'

sure. right.
how do you exorcise ignorant out of someone?

Posted by Samurai i still laugh when people say that we 'choose' to be this way. Hardy har har... yeah, like it's something where you wake up and say, 'jeez, i think i'll be gay now.' sure. right. how do you exorcise ignorant out of someone?

Education. I don't think that we could change his mind, but we might be able to enlighten him a bit.

I think he was saying that you choose your behavior, not your state of being. This is true, but I would argue that the human need for closeness overrides any "choice" we might make.

There is no good reason to condemn homosexuality.

The only possible logical reason would be that gay sex is not procreative. I suspect that that is probably the original motivation for religions condemning gaiety. Reproduction=more followers.

Posted by splumer The only possible logical reason would be that gay sex is not procreative. I suspect that that is probably the original motivation for religions condemning gaiety. Reproduction=more followers.

I'm not sure that it is a good reason just because it is true. By condemnation I mean labelling it as evil, an abomination, or somehow sub-human and making OK for the more feebleminded among us to hate, discriminate or promote violence.

Lots of things are allowed and even encouraged that are not procreative, or even beneficial.

Consider alcohol. It is widely accepted and promoted. The catholics pass it out to go with your zombie crackers. On the whole it is far more harmful than, say, homosexuality when you factor in the societal and personal costs of alcoholism, drinking and driving, and the medical costs associated with alcohol related injuries and sickness.

But the loudest voices are the ones that scream about the evils of the gays and how our society will be destroyed if we don't fight against gay marriage. It's too late for that, I think, and it's not the homos that did it. Watch fox news or the bachelor...

The only explanation for his attitude is unjustified fear. Religion is one of the fallacies that people use as an excuse for divisive behaviour towards other human beings.

Posted by tekriter I'm not sure that it is a good reason just because it is true. By condemnation I mean labelling it as evil, an abomination, or somehow sub-human and making OK for the more feebleminded among us to hate, discriminate or promote violence.

I never said it was a good reason, only a passably logical one. Have some lulz:

http://knowyourmem.../advice-god/photos

Romans "Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another."

Clearly the bible is against gayness amongst women.

splumer, you got it! Perhaps a pedophile can't "choose" not to be attracted to children, but they can choose whether to become child molesters or not. They can also choose to recognize their sickness is unnatural and not something to be encourage or "accepted" by society. Similarly with homosexuals. I also firmly believe there are plenty of "bisexuals" and some homosexuals that engage in the lifestyle out of choice and not due to the mental illness of homosexuality.

Posted by MrGreenJeans Romans "Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another." Clearly the bible is against gayness amongst women.

Yeah, you are right. I missed that one. Paul is a douche all the way through, it's not surprising that he picks one more group to hate. Point for you.

But...the bible is all bullshit anyway - not really evidence of enaything. Even if you buy this one, you still have not explained all the teachings you don't follow. You CHOOSE which ones, just as you CHOOSE to hate homosexuals.

Posted by MrGreenJeans splumer, you got it! Perhaps a pedophile can't "choose" not to be attracted to children, but they can choose whether to become child molesters or not. They can also choose to recognize their sickness is unnatural and not something to be encourage or "accepted" by society. Similarly with homosexuals. I also firmly believe there are plenty of "bisexuals" and some homosexuals that engage in the lifestyle out of choice and not due to the mental illness of homosexuality.

This is a false analogy. (anal-ogy - giggity)

Children need to be protected. Sex with children is proscribed because children are vulnerable and unable to make informed decisions on consent. Sex between two consenting adults - gay, bi or straight - simply can't be compared.

Homosexuality is not listed in any diagnostic manual or recognized by any professional medical establishment as a mental illness - that's just your hate burning through again.

By the same token you would be hetero and CHOOSE to act on it. Still places the onus on you for your mall mindedness, unreasonable fear and hate mongering.

Posted by tekriter Homosexuality is not listed in any diagnostic manual or recognized by any professional medical establishment as a mental illness

Well, not any current diagnostic manual.

Posted by MutantMandias Well, not any current diagnostic manual.

Very true. But the vast majority of us know better now. Just like we know the sun does not revolve around the earth and the earth isn't flat.

Hey tek, where can I get one of those goofy hats?

Why can't people under the age of 18 make decisions? They can work and pay taxes. What's with the magic number? No matter, I didn't mention children anyway you're just interjecting that. I was merely discussing unnatural sexual desires such as pedophilia and homosexuality. I suppose perhaps you simply can't argue the point effectively without changing the subject.

As Mutant reminded you, homosexuality has been in many mental health manuals until the homosexuals put pressure on the mental health system to remove it. I suppose if NAMLBA got their way and had pedophilia removed as well then it would be okay.

According to the CDC gay men are the only group in which HIV infections are actually increasing, perhaps it should be discouraged simply on a national health basis. Good luck dodging that bug Sam.

Posted by MrGreenJeans Hey tek, where can I get one of those goofy hats?

Haven't you made your own?

Why can't people under the age of 18 make decisions? They can work and pay taxes. What's with the magic number? No matter, I didn't mention children anyway you're just interjecting that. I was merely discussing unnatural sexual desires such as pedophilia and homosexuality. I suppose perhaps you simply can't argue the point effectively without changing the subject.

No? Then what was this:

Perhaps a pedophile can't "choose" not to be attracted to children, but they can choose whether to become child molesters or not.

The age of consent is an arbitrary point. There is no magic that happens on someone's 18th (or 16th in many states) birthday that allows him or her to give consent, but there's got to be a cutoff somwhere. A 17-year-old girl a day before she turns 18 can, for all intents & purposes, give as much consent as she can a day later, but in the eyes of the law, she cannot.

As Mutant reminded you, homosexuality has been in many mental health manuals until the homosexuals put pressure on the mental health system to remove it. I suppose if NAMLBA got their way and had pedophilia removed as well then it would be okay.

Evidence? Homosexual behavior appears in non-human animals as well. And if the Bible is the only reason one has for condemning homsexual behavior, that's not a very good basis for a medical diagnosis, is it? Perhaps a good bloodletting will cure teh ghey out you!

According to the CDC gay men are the only group in which HIV infections are actually increasing, perhaps it should be discouraged simply on a national health basis. Good luck dodging that bug Sam.

WRONG! Maybe in 1990, but not now. HIV is declining in every demographic, at least according to the dean of the medical school in which I work. We do HIV research here, BTW. It's declining because of increased use of barrier methods among at-risk populations and a decreasing stigma associated with their use. The lowest decline was in heterosexual teens.

So, I'm curious MGJ, why do YOU condemn homosexuality? You personally. I want your opinion.

Posted by MrGreenJeans As Mutant reminded you, homosexuality has been in many mental health manuals until the homosexuals put pressure on the mental health system to remove it. I suppose if NAMLBA got their way and had pedophilia removed as well then it would be okay.

Yes, I did point out that the DSM used to include it, as Tek pointed out that most books used to say that the Earth was the center of the universe, until the logical thinkers put pressure on the factually anemic religious system to stop it.

And, of course, homosexuality, heterosexuality, and pedophilia are all completely natural. They are all created by God, if you desire to believe in God. Or, if you prefer logic, they are all naturally occurring phenomena, with roots that are evident before birth.

Posted by splumer The only possible logical reason would be that gay sex is not procreative. I suspect that that is probably the original motivation for religions condemning gaiety. Reproduction=more followers.

Maybe the world needs more gays, they tend to be critical thinkers and non religious (at least from the ones I know), and with the lessening of procreation well... The human population is getting to be far higher than is sustainable.

"critical thinkers" lol One would think that if a sexual pervert were such a critical thinker they would think not to engage in their perversion rather than try to convince right thinking people that it's simply a "lifestyle". I suppose you must be so enlightened that you think anyone who agrees with your worldview must be brilliant.

I mean to say I did not mention children as willing sexual partners, only as victims of pedophilia and not in the context of whether or not their consent is valid. teks "comeback" had nothing to do with my original analogy (giggity)

According to the CDC HIV infections among gays were around 24K, while heterosexual infections were only half as much. Maybe you're right and the CDC is wrong. According to the NYU medical centers website, from 2001 to 2004 HIV infections among gays increased while those among heterosexuals and even drug addicts decreased. I do realize that data is a couple years old so maybe there has been some drastic turn around since then.

The International Classification of Diseases put out by the World Health Organization was updated only in 1990 removing homosexuality from the list. While not in the "current" version, it was considered a mental disease until then. I would say that was fairly recently. According to the windsorstar Alberta hasn't adopted the new list and doctors there continue to bill the government for treating homos as mental patients. I figured I'd throw that in since this is technically a Canadian website.

Certainly if homosexuality is not an abnormality then it must then be a choice. You can't have it both ways.

The good news is the likelihood of suicide is higher amongst queers and dykes than among heterosexuals. Sam, If you're going to go that route please don't make a whiny youtube video, those are getting old.

Posted by MrGreenJeans Certainly if homosexuality is not an abnormality then it must then be a choice. You can't have it both ways.

You can't even have it one of those ways. Homosexuality is neither an abnormality nor a choice.

Posted by MrGreenJeans The good news is the likelihood of suicide is higher amongst queers and dykes than among heterosexuals.

Yeah, and high blood pressure kills off more male niggers than female spades.
And jews are cheap.
And women are whores.

Now that's just racist ... I though you gay atheists were against that sort of talk?

Since the vast majority of humanity is heterosexual, then being born gay would mean that gays are born with an abnormality making them unlike the vast majority of other humans. It's a proven fact that the brains of cross dressers are physically abnormal compared to the brains of heterosexuals. Since many of them are in fact gays to begin with I would bet similar studies on gays would show the same brain abnormalities.

I suppose being born as a pedophile, or with down syndrome or a dozen toes isn't abnormal either, right?

abnormal is not the same as unnatural.

I guess red heads and abnormal and should be stoned to death as well.

It's kind of sad that a thread I posted about a central message in all religions being to love one another regardless of differences, hoping it would outline something that a lot of people seem to be lacking; has turned into this.
Way to re-affirm that religion and religious people are a waste of time GreenJeans!

Posted by MutantMandias abnormal is not the same as unnatural. I guess red heads and abnormal and should be stoned to death as well.

lol that's all you can come up with? Most redheads aren't unnatural, disease spreading perverts. Most anyway.

Kyle, you are wrong. The central message of religion is not to "love everyone no matter what". You've simply been brainwashed by the liberals. If that were the case then there would be no religion, since it wouldn't matter anyway. Different religions teach different things, and you must choose what you put your faith in and pray that other do the same for their own salvation. Religion is not about hating anyone, but it's central core is definitely not about loving everyone.

Posted by MrGreenJeans Religion is not about hating anyone

Then how do you explain Mr. Green Jeans?