Posted by Mr_Fiend How bout the people who actually KILLED over some damn book be responsible for any deaths. They would be the murderers, not him. He has a right to do that, they dont have a right to kill. How bout they learn to control their anger and develope some back bones and learn to "turn the other cheek", oh wait, they arent taught to be peaceful towards infidels.

I am not excusing what the extremists have done. But To say that this man who did the burning is free of blame 100% is just insane. Insighting violence on purpose(and yes, his actions DO show he did this) is never ok. PERIOD

Charles Manson never killed anyone, should we just let him free too?

Posted by MonkeyPunchBaby I am referring to the spreading of hatred against people who don't believe the same thing you do.

You keep saying that, but you havent said any specifics.

Posted by Samurai You live in Oklahoma, correct? How well received are gay people? Or are they fucking faggots? Queers? Ass rapers?

You would be pleasantly surprised, especially in larger cities such as Tulsa and OKC.

Posted by Samurai How could this idiot not know how muslims would take this shit? In that respect, i feel that this so-called preacher IS responsible for the lives taken during this latest muslim rampage.

So the muslims who killed (over a book!), are the lesser evil in this instance???

Posted by maypost I am not excusing what the extremists have done. But To say that this man who did the burning is free of blame 100% is just insane.

K, agreed. I was just making sure.


He stired up a rattle snake den or a hornets nest, whichever you want to say. He may have stired it up, but the inherent violent nature of the things stired up, did the actual violent act.

There is no lesser evil in this situation. It's thinking like that which justifies murder on both sides of this pointless conflict. Saying one side is more to blame just adds to the body count in the long run.

EVERYONE involved was wrong, it makes no matter who was more wrong. Wrong is wrong. I can not understand why this is so hard for so many people to grasp.

Let's all stop assigning blame and learn from this terrible situation

Posted by maypost Let's all stop assigning blame and learn from this terrible situation

Yes, dont mess with the Koran, or they'll kill people. Thats exactly what happened here. Dont stir up a hornets nest, nvm that hornets are armed and ready to strike at the littlest thing.

I'm not trying to say what is right or what is wrong here, I'm just pointing out that the preacher was the instigator, and the muslims were the murderers. Right?

Posted by Mr_Fiend Yes, dont mess with the Koran, or they'll kill people. Thats exactly what happened here. Dont stir up a hornets nest, nvm that hornets are armed and ready to strike at the littlest thing. I'm not trying to say what is right or what is wrong here, I'm just pointing out that the preacher was the instigator, and the muslims were the murderers. Right?

Seriously?

How can you be filled with so much hate?

This is an honest question, not meant to rile you up.

But the broad statements you make about an entire religion is so filled with hate and mis-information that I can't find another word to describe it other than overt racism.

Posted by maypost How can you be filled with so much hate?

I'm sorry, but when did I ever hate anyone? Or say I did?


You didnt answer my question. The preacher was the instigator, and the muslims were the murderers. Right?

Posted by maypost I can't find another word to describe it other than overt racism

Do you know what racism is? It has nothing to do with religion, specifically islam. Islam is not tied down to one race. So you really need stop your agenda of making me into a racist, because it doesnt hold up, at all.

Posted by Mr_Fiend How bout the people who actually KILLED over some damn book be responsible for any deaths. They would be the murderers, not him. He has a right to do that, they dont have a right to kill. How bout they learn to control their anger and develope some back bones and learn to "turn the other cheek", oh wait, they arent taught to be peaceful towards infidels.

Are Muslims taught the "turn the other cheek" thingy? Honestly, I don't know. My understanding is that controlling their anger isn't an option--they are called to defend their faith even if it means dying and killing, controlling their anger doesn't fit with that. Now, in the west we can say that yeah, ya can't kill everyone that offends your faith, that's nutty. But, the killings aren't in the west (yet). The point is, the "Christian" preacher knew what he was doing would result in violence and he did it anyway. He is culpable for the deaths of over 20 people. Good job, preacher, Jesus approves.

Posted by maypost Seriously? How can you be filled with so much hate? This is an honest question, not meant to rile you up. But the broad statements you make about an entire religion is so filled with hate and mis-information that I can't find another word to describe it other than overt racism.

point made! i was waiting for someone else to call you out fiend. and thankfully Maypost did not disappoint.

Posted by Mr_Fiend I'm sorry, but when did I ever hate anyone? Or say I did? You didnt answer my question. The preacher was the instigator, and the muslims were the murderers. Right? Do you know what racism is? It has nothing to do with religion, specifically islam. Islam is not tied down to one race. So you really need stop your agenda of making me into a racist, because it doesnt hold up, at all.

Fair enough.

You sir, are a bigot

As to the 1st part of your post... I already answered it before you asked it. But I don't expect you to read and actually grasp what I am saying.

STOP SAYING ONE SIDE OF THIS IS WORSE. You are assigning blame, there is pleanty to go around. EVERY side of this is WRONG period. It does not matter who started, who killed who or any of that. All sides are wrong. But you are obviously not capable of grasping that because of your irrational and bigotted hatred towards all things that you do not agree with or understand.

Posted by maypost You sir, are a bigot

Instead of calling me names, please answer my questions so that we may continue to have a mature discussion.


When did I ever hate anyone? Or say I did?

The preacher was the instigator, and the muslims were the murderers. Right?

Do you know what racism is?

Posted by maypost It does not matter who started, who killed who or any of that.

It does matter. One person did a harmless act of burning a book (yes with threats of death if he did it), and the other side killed because of that act. Both made poor decisions, but one took it to a whole nother level, that was entirely uncalled for. And not saying they are different, is saying burning a book is no worse than murder, or that murder is no worse than burning a book.

I'd think our judicial system would have put one side to death, and slapped the wrist of the other.

Posted by Mr_Fiend Instead of calling me names, please answer my questions so that we may continue to have a mature discussion.

there is no mature discussion with you. thats why no one is trying.

Posted by Mr_Fiend It does matter. One person did a harmless act of burning a book(yes with threats of death if he did it

And he wonders why I think he is a bigot...

Book burning is what almost wiped my people off the planet.

Its like trying to have a discussion with a bunch of 5 year olds. "you're stupid", "you're just a hater", "you're a racist", "you're a big doo doo head".

All you guys can do (with the exception of some more mature people on here) is name call, with no real explanations as to why.

Posted by maypost And he wonders why I think he is a bigot... Book burning is what almost wiped my people off the planet.

out of curiosity, i will ask before anyone else does because you know i will be asking you with respect, who are your people?

Posted by Mr_Fiend Its like trying to have a discussion with a bunch of 5 year olds. "you're stupid", "you're just a hater", "you're a racist", "you're a big doo doo head". All you guys can do (with the exception of some more mature people on here) is name call, with no real explanations as to why.

far from it pal. You say things that just huge generalizations and stereotypes that its impossible to have a conversation with you. i have yet to call you any names that do not have enough evidence to support my claim.

if i sat here and said "i hate n*****s" (uncensored of course). would you think i was anything but racist?

Posted by Mr_Fiend Its like trying to have a discussion with a bunch of 5 year olds. "you're stupid", "you're just a hater", "you're a racist", "you're a big doo doo head". All you guys can do (with the exception of some more mature people on here) is name call, with no real explanations as to why.

Dude, you are calling book burning harmless!

That is beyond hateful that I can't even start to understand how a free thinking western person could ever think that way. Sure you have every right to believe burning any holy text is "harmless". But I will always stand up and call it out for the hatred it is. ALWAYS.

You have no idea what it is like to be part of a cultural community that has been subject to real genocide. So get off your high horse and stop acting like you have even a clue the gravity of what you are saying. I went to the holocaust museum and say my family name on teh wall of killed Jews. So yes, if you are saying burning a book to symbolize the "evils" of any religion is in any way ok... you are a bigot and I will continue top say so.

Call it name calling, but you are talking about things you have absolutely no understanding of.

Posted by Samurai The only thing to keep christians from killing people and raging like muslims is the belief in our system of laws. Also, it's a laziness in faith, as well. Christians are generally from reasonably well-off societies which translates to a laziness (?).

I don't think it's laziness, it's a desire (or a realization) not to mess with how good they have it. I have to admit, Christianity seems a lot more logical in many ways than Islam. Revenge killings serve no logical purpose, especially when the people who were killed had no connection to the actual burning. And are they really so stupid to think that their retaliation is going to deter anyone? Or change anyone minds about Islam? On the contrary, people will think it's even more fucked up than they did before.

But, the dude who did the burning, while not strictly responsible, still bears some. If you leave your keys in your car in a bad neighborhood, and your car gets stolen, that doesn't excuse car theft, but you still bear some responsibility.

I recently read a book called The Portable Atheist, and it had a chapter that talked about (among other things) the history of the Koran and how, despite claims to the contrary, it has gone through editing and revisions as well, much like the Bible, and to say that it was the exact text Mohammed took down in the 7th century is very inaccurate. Different editions exist, and chapters contradict and supercede each other, depending on how they are organized. They're organized often by length, rather than chronologically or any other logical method, and the chapters that appear first are supposed to supercede later chapters. It's a wonder any of them can make sense out of it at all.

And you don't have to be racist to be a bigot.

Posted by maypost That is beyond hateful that I can't even start to understand how a free thinking western person could ever think that way.

Farting in a crowded elevator would even be hateful to you.

Posted by maypost Call it name calling, but you are talking about things you have absolutely no understanding of.

And I say the same thing about what you are saying, but I dont call you names!

Posted by maypost I went to the holocaust museum and say my family name on teh wall of killed Jews. So yes, if you are saying burning a book to symbolize the "evils" of any religion is in any way ok... you are a bigot and I will continue top say so.

Muslims countries burn bibles and american flags all the time, but you dont seem to be as fired up about that. That is the same exact thing, yet you cant seem to call them racist haters.

They are just books. The symbols and principles behind them are different for different "book burnings".

You have consistently side tracked this conversation away from the FACT that people with "peaceful" beliefs retaliated with murder over a book. A book!

Murder over a book being destroyed!!!! And I'm the hater? I'm the racist? What the fuck?

While showering I had an epiphany. This is not simple book burning. This isn't some church burning porno or a group of people burning Cather in the Rye, this the holy book of millions, maybe even billions of people. To simply call it a plain ol' book burning is moronic.

Yes, yes you are.

And you will continue to be as long as long as you group all Muslim people in the catagory of these extreamists.


I have not defended anyone in this entire unfolding and you know it.